Eh-Scooters. You have been warned, my British Friends
But we already have that - even though they are illegal it doesn’t stop anyone (plus riding bikes on the pavement round here)
True that. Round my way they come at you in groups riding the wrong way down the one way street and look at you as if it is you who is in the wrong.
When we were in Mallorca a few weeks ago we had our first experience of electric scooters. It wasn’t a positive one. Lethal springs to mind.
We have kids down Devonshire Road on these things everyday, they’re either weaving on the road or whizzing on the pavement and when they ask you to move and you gently remind them they’re not meant to use the footpath, they look at you as if you’re an A-Hole (excuse my French). I don’t move anymore for them or people that use the footpath when bike riding. I mostly have my headphones in so pretend I don;t hear them asking me to move!!!
As a side note, I have seen a couple of kids wipe out down our road on them!!! Going too fast over the speed-bumps. Not too sure if these kids know about the laws of physics…I do get concerned for them but once I know they’re OK, I do feel it’s karma!!!
These certainly seem more prevalent, and I’ve seen a few going scarily fast on the pavement (as I have some bikes also).
For the first time today I saw someone pulled over outside the Horniman (assume they were on the road) by a policeman on motorbike, and it looked like the scooter was about to be confiscated as it had a label of sorts attached to the handlebars.
My understanding from a few months ago was that you could only hire them and they were only allowed on the road - is there anywhere local to hire them if people did want to use them? Or is every escooter you see around here effectively being used illegally?
I’m not against them per se, but some seem very high powered.
I believe that unless they are hired, then every single on your see on pavement or on the road is illegal, yet they are everywhere. Beggars belief doesn’t it …
I saw one escooter rider being given a ticket in Catford.
I think they are only allowed on the road.
I have also seen someone on something that looks like an electric unicycle.
I don’t think so Sherwood. I believe they are illegal on the road unless its a hire scooter. Here is the guidance. The scooter must be on hire, insured and the rider has to have at the very least a provisional driving licence with L plates. The biggest joke is that London is not even a designated trial area so under the current regulations there should not even be a single one in London at all.
E-scooters are a menace but particularly those on pavements who generally have the attitude that everyone else should move out of the way for them. They also don’t make any allowance for those with mobility issues.
If you can only ride hired ones legally, you’d think purchasing them might be restrictred…
Be interesting to see if the study shows how this affects commuting behaviour in terms of transport usage / walkng / cycling, as well as recommended safety and enforcement issues.
There’s probably still an argument that you could purchase and use them legally on private land… though that’s not what appears to be happening.
It’s a tricky one really. I can see the potential benefits of e-scooters, but they occupy that difficult area somewhere between a pedestrian and vehicle, but not quite being safe around either. Push-bikes are similar in that respect, but cyclists seem more disciplined and aware of how to ride safely (well, not all of them, but on the whole I’d say most of us are) and there’s proficiency courses and training that starts from childhood.
With e-scooters it’s a brave new world, and while there is guidance, as @Thewrongtrousers points out, there isn’t much in the way of enforcement for those that choose to ignore it.
It’s a shame the hover-board things didn’t take off really. They seemed more pavement bound and a bit safer around others, well if you discount the battery packs catching fire during charging.
It’s the speed and shock of being passed so close that can cause a frail person to fall. Many people don’t realize how easily an older person can lose balance. It’s reckless endangerment to ride these things on the pavement or any pedestrianised areas.
I got my information from listening to the man who hires them out. He said he was having problems with his hirers riding them on the pavement. I think he said he was going to use technology to determine who was doing this and stop it.
I was walking from Honor Oak Park station earlier today and witnessed a young guy on one travelling in the middle of the road going much faster than 20mph. Had no safety clothes on and of course no helmet. Had someone stepped out in the road both would easily have a bad time.
If as it seems that these things are illegal, then I don’t understand how it is that there seems to be no enforcement. If I rode my motorcycle up and down the pavement I reckon I would be nicked in no time. I just can not get my head around how it is that this sort of blatant transgression has become normalised.
There’s a guy who goes up my road rather swiftly on an e-scooter. It has felt like there are more around over the last few months. I can see the appeal - they take up less room on trains if you are using them to get to/from stations etc.
I’ve also been surprised in recent days at how fast modern electric wheelchairs go. There’s a chap near me who takes his kids (to school, I assume) and really zooms along the pavement in the morning.
Perhaps the motorcycle gangs will get involved and put a stop to this e-scooter madness if the police won’t
So much to look forward to …
Don’t ride them over the limit if you value your licence
I saw a young man with a small child standing on the front…no helmet, looked terrified, coming down St German’s road then going up onto the pavement along Brockley Rise.
I totally agree. They shouldn’t be rode on the pavements full stop, nor should cycles.
If my mum was still alive, I think it would start to put her off going out altogether, as she got knocked off her feet once just by 2 young men walking past. She wasn’t looking where she was going to be fair, but was already quite frail.
Just to finish the tale, I met the 2 men when they visited her in hospital after she was admitted & were really apologetic.
They are now also being taken on the buses & the tubes! A tripping hazard waiting to happen!
Lewisham isn’t mentioned, but it can’t be far behind…
Completely agree. And if you aren’t allowed to cycle on the pavement (rightly) then I don’t think being on the pavement on motorised transport is right, unless it’s on a mobility scooter.
And some mobility scooters could do with speed limiters and a dead man’s brake. My mum got struck by an out of control one in Waitrose when she was in her 80s. The Waitrose manager said they’d had trouble with the woman driver before, that she couldn’t control the machine and one time she knocked a whole display unit over, but they couldn’t do anything to stop her using it in the shop because of her “rights”.
Some mobility scooter users blow their horns at pedestrians who get in their way!
Can anyone who has ridden one tell us what the balance is like at 3mph?
They can always get off and push.
Escooters are also terribly bad for the planet. According to research by Warwick University their average lifespan is 1-5 months before they are scrapped. The throwaway society is alive and well.
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It would be interesting to compare that to other rental vehicles. In the US, rental cars are renewed every 4 and 22 months with an average of every 13. As with any rentals there is the possibility of a secondary market for used equipment and I would presume the same could apply to e-scooters.
I’d be interested to know the similar figure for rental bikes. These, because of their design specific for rental markets may not have any value beyond its normal rental lifestyle other then scrap.
Interesting analysis. I wonder how this compares to eBikes, which are similar in many respects, but as the report notes are “separately legislated”. I imagine eBikes are far more serviceable, so have a much longer lifespan, while things like hoverboards are look much like disposable toys!
Many French users throw e-scooters in the Seine!
I own one myself, it would not be difficult to ride at 3mph but I suppose it’s a personal preference type of thing, some might find it easier than others.
I think the statement that ‘Escooters are terribly bad for the planet’ is false. Firstly, their research was done purely on the rental scooter market, which must make up a very small percentage of the actual scooter market, being as most scooters are privately owned and only 6 areas / boroughs have rental scooters available. Secondly, rental scooters are always going to degrade and break down more than privately owned scooters due to them being exposed to a variety of weather conditions as well as people taking less care with them. I personally have had my scooter for a year and a half, done over 2000 miles on it and have only had to replace 1 punctured tyre. Even if rental scooters are only lasting 5 months, the vast majority of the scooter can be recycled, batteries, the plastic body and the aluminium frame are all widely recyclable. Don’t get me wrong i’m all for limiting the speeds of the scooter and having a minimum age requirement, however it is important not to throw about claims that it is bad for the planet without sufficient research.
It’s not my job to delve further into Warwick University’s research. But in my opinion something that is as expensive to produce in terms of damage to the environment and workers as the ore used to produce the batteries currently available and then to junk the majority of Escooters after one to five years is not good for the planet. I feel the same about mobile phones and if I had managed to get a Fairphone that actually worked, I would have switched to one when my aged Samsung finally conked out.
I’m genuinely intrigued to know where you did your 2000 miles. I thought Escooters were illegal on pavements and public roads, apart from rentals and a few recent trial areas. Was this abroad?
I mainly use my scooter to commute to and from work, around 3-4 miles each way each day, plus the odd trip to shops. I’ve spoken to police officers on a few occasions and they have all been very understanding of why I use my scooter and have never had an issue with it. Of course there will be young or idiotic people that ride around on them recklessly, but this is the same for pretty much any motorised or non motorised mode of transport. I agree that the mining of Lithium is bad for the environment, however surely this is somewhat offset by the fact that this is getting people to travel using cleaner and greener methods, in terms not generating Co2 etc.
You may be a safe rider but if I drove my car without tax and insurance I would expect to be pulled over the same with these E-scooter and if they are stopped by the police which I very much doubt and confiscated the offender should be fined a minimum of £500 on the spot and charged for disposal of the vehicle if they can’t pay them imprisonment for two years and tagged for them 3 more Whose officers you spoke to need to be disciplined and suspended without pay and investigated for failure to do their jobs properly and the rest of them get out of their canteen and do there job instead of going for easy targets to massage there crime resolved numbers. .
A bit of coverage from Metro:
What other things should we ban then? Presumably jogging, phone use while walking and headphones.
But we already have banned the use of the phone when driving. True that in most cases damage to the inattentive headphone or mobile phone user when walking/running is confined to the walker/runner themselves, but not always and the trauma to the person they collide with must be awful. Surely no sensible person would wear headphones or use their mobile when cycling?
The case for licensing and third party insurance of vehicles that use public space is clear, I’d have thought.
I think part of the problem is in trying to legislate for e-scooters as one broad thing. Maybe it would make more sense to divide them into categories and set legislation and limits for each type, like already done with moped (50cc engine or less) \ motorcycle licences.
For example, one category could be for e-scooters \ hoverboards that are allowed on pavements, limited to walking pace and the device must be under a certain weight, but no licence is required.
Another class could require registration, a licence, insurance, wearing of a helmet and MOT and be limited to 30mph for urban roads. Driving these on the pavement or motorways would be very illegal.
The 15mph speed limit currently being widely considered (or ignored) means escooters aren’t really suited to the road or pavements and can be a hazard on both.
I’ve seen a lot of people cycling with headphones on!
I’ve seen a few over here in Portugal - out in the sticks. People use them to get to work and given the price of fuel and lack of public transport it seems like a great idea.
I don’t see the issue with them in London. Limit them the same as ebikes and ban them from the pavement. There isn’t much difference except for ebikes are pedal assist. I am not sure the ride is that comfy on some of London roads but some bigger tyres would help with that.
At a time when we are very aware of the perils of car use and with people being wary of public transport I would have thought they would be more accepted.
I think part of the problem is that they are already banned from the pavements as with many other kinds of antisocial/dangerous behaviour. However, making certain behaviour unlawful or ‘banning’ it is easy to do. The far more difficult thing is to actually enforce the law. For that you need police officers, and how many of those do you see about the place. For that reason alone, it’s probably a lost cause until there are some examples of some citizens getting badly hurt by these things. Then the tide may change.
I don’t mean to sound like I’m a moaning old whatsit, (I’m not actually that old) but people are now taking these e scooters on buses & trains, & even the tube!
Unless tucked right away (not easy) under the feet of the rider, they are a trip hazard!
Again as with bikes, I’ve always said if you want to ride one, then ride it, don’t block up public transport with them! I know most trains now have the capacity to accommodate bikes, but even now you will always get the one who thinks it’s his or her right to block the doors!
And the Escooter footboard bit is just at ankle banging and tripping up height too.
Exactly! That is what worries me
Some cyclists do wear headphones while cycling around central london. I have to say that as a cyclist I don’t really get it, because I know I rely a lot on being able to hear what is going on behind/around me. I think I am also unusual in not listening to headphones whilst out running/walking for the same reason. But I have definitely seen other people cycling with headphones and whatever I think about it, I don’t think there is legislation to prevent it.
That annoys me too and I am a cyclist. Mind you, I have a Brompton so mine only presents half a problem! And I very rarely have it on the train.
I have started to wear in ear earphones when out so I am hands free when walking or on public transport, but only to talk on my phone as I have an injured arm & it hurts if I have my arm bent for too long. But I wouldn’t listen to music as I could see it as a distraction, & I like to know what is going on around me! I can still look round & it is actually easier on foot than holding the phone in my hand. But surely a cyclist needs their wits about them at all times.
I think it makes a lot of sense to do it when you’re on a phonecall, especially if you have wireless headphones, because it’s definitely easier and also means your phone isn’t on display.
Yes definitely, as there has been a spate of phone snatching again recently, I saw on the news last night that the police are going round the west wend warning people.
I still have a 5SE I phone, so won’t be of much value, it it still works fine, still does updates & now I’ve got an iPad I use this more than the phone anyway!
I haven’t got wireless headphones, only just getting used to the normal in ear ones!
Trouble is Gill that if you get mugged by a drive-by Escooter or cyclist thief they won’t know yours is an older phone till after they’ve mugged you. I don’t use my phone on the street unless I can tuck myself in somewhere safe to do so. I’d rather miss the call.
Yes I agree. I must say at a bus stop I always stand back to look at bus times if necessary. As you say as well it is best to try & be somewhere safe before taking a call.
But as my daughter said with the hands free you can put your phone in your pocket or even in your bag & zip it up, it’s a bit more security.
If I have to look at my phone at bus stops I try to tuck myself behind or as close as possible to the biggest, most glowering looking man there. I think I probably make them nervous though.
BBC News - E-scooters: Public nuisance or climate-friendly travel?
I was down in Southsea last weekend and there were stands of them there. Suspect it’s like most things… the majority who use them will have no problems and cause no problems but there will be a few idiots who will ride them stupidly. And, inevitably, do it in a stupidly visible and/or dangerous manner that will taint the reputation of the law-abiding majority.
I’ve now begun to see lines of e-scooters available to rent in Central London. However, Royal Parks have now banned these from the parks.
I wonder how this will be policed in practice, unless there is some built in stop for them when they enter the Royal Parks.
Seems a slightly odd decision, not sure how I feel about it. Plus we don’t get to see a video of a Red Deer chasing someone on a scooter.
In most Royal Parks even cycling is limited to a specific number of limited routes. Pedestrians have always had priority. In the parks I use in central London I often see park patrols stopping cyclists, usually people on Sanrander bikes.
There is now a line of e-scooters for rent on an island in Trafalgar Square. I despair at the thought of new users renting their first in the midst of traffic ridden intersections, or practising on the pavement or pedestrian areas there with families enjoying the sites.
People were riding Santander bicycles along the platforms at London Bridge and Waterloo East railway stations last night.
It surely oughtn’t to be beyond the brains of techies to install some sort of cut off mechanism that stops e-scooters being used or even taken onto sensitive areas like railway stations. The brakes come on on Sainsbury’s shopping trolleys if you try to push them from the store precincts to the bus stop.
I’ve seen people riding with a passenger on these things.
The same is true for cars, but for one reason or another this has not happened. Far more people have been injured by cars speeding, than scooters speeding, and so the money should be put into stopping cars from speeding, as a priority over banning other means of travel (scooters, bikes) that are overall far less risk to peoples safety overall.
Provisions for newer forms of transport like scooters and cars are far behind demand, and this needs to change. Maybe one day Lewisham will catch up with the rest of London…
The Uber electric ones are speed limited in certain areas and I believe stop working when outside their catchment zone.
The law is being blatently broken by e scooter riders and (on pavement)adult bike riders .I have never seen any police stopping them.
Not the first time I see these scooters zooming about earphones in or on mobile no road awareness. Near misses but they don’t care road priority to them. I have seen a car bump another car the cause scooter . They Didn’t hang about to acknowledge not my problem attitude. Mind you they didn’t notice or care. Wasn’t a serious accident could of been. Even seen ones with seats now that was a just eat delivery person using this style. Whatever next? The world sure as gone mad and lost itself to something. Nope it must be me
The BBC are reporting on how easy it is to have e-scooters modified so that they can reach speeds of up to 20mph, for as little as £15:
Given it’s already illegal to ride private e-scooters on pavements and roads, I don’t know how criminalising scooter modifications will achieve much - as the article points out:
You don’t even need to pay a mechanic, there are step by step guides on google.
Well, indeed that does sound terrifying when most performance cars are sensibly limited to 155mph despite the fact that the speed limit is 70mph. You can of course fortunately still pay the manufacturer to remove the limiter, legally so that you have the opportunity to illegally drive even faster than double the speed limit.
So yes, I agree, criminalising modifications won’t achieve very much. It’s the fact that people are concerned about limiting eScooters the I find baffling. How about limiting cars to 20mph limits where applicable in cities instead? I’d prefer more people riding eScooters and fewer people in cars to be honest.
My main concern is the number of people who ride them in the pavement, it’s scary how fast some people ride them on pedestrian footpaths.
So if I had the option between a scooter doing 15/20mph on the pavement or a car doing 30mph on the road I’d take the car any day, because in my view the former poses far more of a danger to my kids and other kids, and others of course eg the less mobile.
I don’t however think they are issues that need to fight against each other, you can actively support both (or disagree with both of course!).
On the road I don’t have a massive issue with them.
eScooters most certainly do not cause more of a danger to kids than cars. I’m happy to be corrected with stats. Also I imagine it’s hard to get up to 15mph on any pavement around here.
Meanwhile I walked around town for a couple of hours today delivering newsletters and I saw exactly zero eScooters (road or pavement) - there were however plenty of cars doing questionable speeds.
I think really though, your argument makes a good case for segregated infrastructure. Pavements for pedestrians, segregated lanes for bikes and scooters (happy to share here) and a lane for motor vehicles.
That’s not what I said. There are far more cars and they are bigger so they will cause more injuries, sure. A car going at 30mph will generally cause more serious injury than one going at 20mph, or 15, or 10, or 5. Agreed.
I expressed an opinion on what I would prefer out of the two options. For my situation, where I walk my kids to school and various after school activities I am more concerned about escooters and bikes on the pavement, which I see and we have to make way for regularly (less so on the morning school run).
I am more concerned about an unexpected escooter on the pavement than us not seeing a car coming in the road if that makes sense. That doesn’t detract from the point about cards being dangerous the faster they go but that is how I feel.
Perhaps it’s becuase we live on a main road, and therefore more escooter and bike traffic natually goes that way, and consequently you have more on the pavements. I’m not making it up I promise.
For the sake of objectivity I will say in my time here I have known 3 cars come off the road on the road I live on and destroy walls - I’m not aware of the specific reasons for them but suspect speed will have been involved at least in part in some of them.
I don’t have a speed gun but Id’ say I’ve seen in at least 5 occasions. 5 occasions doesn’t sound much but as more and more escooters come into service that could become more problematic. It is generally later in the say, probably post 7pm in fairness, for this sort of speed.
I typically spend a couple of days going around the SE23 each week and I see them daily, both on and off the pavement. I’m not saying it’s an epidemic, but it’s not rare either. Maybe it’s less common at weekends?
Agreed. I would personally hope one day we can have more police patrols as whilst speed is one issue, the way some people drive is crazy, overtaking on roads like Cranston, no indicating etc etc. I’m not a fan of blanket 20mph, I’d prefer a 5-10mph outside schools around opening and closing, maybe 20mph from 7.30am to 9pm and then 30mph after that but suspect that would be too complicated. I would like a lower speed limit around all schools though.
I go back to my main point though, and that this doesn’t have to be about cars - this is about escooters on pavements which are a big no for me, on the road fine.
I think properly segragated cycle lanes work well and I’d generally be all for what you suggest. I’ve used them to cycle to West London and it’s very pleasant. I think if oyu could have them down Brockley Rise and the South Circular linked to residential roads bikes could join from that would be fantastic, but many things to come together for that to happen.
However where I sued to work near Old Street they changed a roundabout and the surrounding pavement layout to make the pdestrian and road level as one. I don’t think I’ve seen anything ever force cars to drive as slowly and carefully as that.
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What makes you believe that the majority of users here do not hold a driving license?
Here is an image from google maps, it’s the junction of Leonard Street and Paul Street. I think they basically paved the junction, there are now food stalls there and some trees and benches (not sure if they were there before). Because of the paving cars slow down, pedestrians walk across etc in harmony. A different mindset if you like.
// I’ve not been there in quite a long time so some things may have changed etc.
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I must say, I’d find that terrifying. And that paving looks as if it would be a nightmare for anyone reliant on a wheeled walker.
I think that’s the thing, you’d think it would be bad, but in practice it;s fine. When I heard they were doing it, I thought it was madness, but actually it worked (I think they have this in other places they had looked at, they didn’t just take a punt on it).
Can’t answer the point about the wheeled walker, but there remains a more traditional pavement to use if required and you could cross further up or down where it is more traditional road.
I like it. Maybe the front of the station area and the dangerous S Circular pedestrian crossing areas could be like that. Slow everything down to walking pace for just a minute so we can cross roads and go about our business safely.
Effectively you’re making it a pedestrian area cars can go across as opposed to a road pedestrians can go across, which leads to a mind change for anyone using it, quite simple when you think about it.
Not sure how it would work on the South Circular but the junction outside the station would benefit from something like the Oxford Circus crossing, though I understand that was very expensive for some reason.
I suspect you need good sightlines for it, and probably on 20mph roads vs 30mph ones for these ones with no traffic lights etc. Anyway, I am way off topic, it’s not the solution to everything but could work in certain places.
This looks like the type of design sometimes referred to Shared Space originally developed in the Netherlands. The idea is that by taking away segregation and priorities you actually slow motorised traffic down and encourage all road users to negotiate who comes first. An added benefit is a more visually attractive streetscape that takes away the domination of the car.
It got trialled in a fair few places in the UK. The one that perhaps got most attention was redevelopment of the Exhibition Road in Kensington in 2012. The approach always had more critics here than in some other countries and is no longer supported by UK standards. Some of the criticism came from accessibility groups with particular concerns in relation to people with visual impairment.
I travel to City Rd everyday via the ‘main’ Old Street Roundabout which has been under alteration for at least 2 years now, this is apparently creating a safer space for cyclists and pedestrians. Unfortunately this has resulted in chaos for buses in the area, an increase of idling traffic in general and of course cyclists deciding whether to use the designated cycle lanes depending on whether the lights controlling them are green or not.
As I’ve said on here before there are stupid cyclists and stupid motorists, unfortunately for those in favour of less cars on the road, the most vocal in their community are becoming more and more militant and irrational which is leading to a greater divide between all road users. I would have hoped that campaigners for any cause would have learned from the european referendum, if you patronise those you don’t agree with, those who are indifferent are unlikely to back those they consider as bullies.
Apologies for going off the topic of E-Scooters, but it has become impossible to have a rational conversation on here (and most social media) about the use of motorised vehicles.
Some years ago the mini-roundabout at the back of East Croydon train station was flattened with kerbs removed in something that must have been inspired by the ‘shared space’ concept. It seemed ok to me (as a pedestrian) with road edges marked with tactile paving presumably for the visually impaired:
More recently it’s been reconfigured and has been peppered with road markings and bollards to make the following slightly confusing monstrosity (though the addition a cycle storage for the station is at least good thing):
I guess the plan here is to bamboozle road users into slowing down, speed limited or not.
I guess the plan here is to bamboozle road users into slowing down, speed limited
If that was indeed their plan I think they can consider it to be “job done”.
That’s a load of bollards…
More detail about that re-working of that particular road (and surrounding) here:
Now slightly less straight forward to cut through to Wellesley Road, though I suppose that might be one of the broader points of the exercise
There are indeed stupid ones on both sides, applies also to eScooter riders. The difference of course is that they have a vastly different impact, pun intended due to kinetic energy of cars being orders of magnitude higher. That’s why you need a license and insurance to drive a car and not to ride a bike or an eScooter. They are not equivalent.
I’m not sure what you mean why this exactly? Is this simply dressing up people as another flavour of ‘angry mobs’ again - I thought we’d moved on from that eh? Is telling people they can cycle to Victoria in 30 mins, or ‘please drive less if you can’ considered militant? Perhaps we could start another topic in the #lounge to discuss this if you’d like.
Why we can’t all just get along and see things from each others perspective. If we all act sensibly there’s enough room on the roads for cyclists, e-scooterists, grown men riding skateboards and normal people.
So why do you compare them?
Militant, favouring confrontational methods in pursuit of a social or political cause, such as using passive aggressive words, like eh.
Irrational, not logical or reasonable, comparing the limiter being removed from a car which has a top speed of 155 mph but will never be driven on the pavement, to increasing the speed of an e scooter which are to be seen regularly on pavements.
No need for any new thread, that would only end up going down the same path.
4 posts were split to a new topic: Posts moved from E-scooters
The police say that e-scooters are the equivalent of a motor car. That is why they require MOT, insurance and number plates, if used on the road or the pavement.
The logic used above seems to me to be like someone saying “I’m not as bad as him. I only stab people. He shoots them.”
The series, which uses all-electric scooters, will take place in locations across the world, with London announced as the first round, on 13-14 May.
The track will weave its way in and out of the Printworks in front of fans watching racing speeds of over 100km/h on the S1-X eSkootrs.
It made me smile post this thread anyway
Hey. Take off you hoser. That’s cultural misappropriation! Unless you can wash down a dozen Timbits covered in maple syrup with a litre of Clamato juice you have no right to use that phrase. Eh!?
I’m sorry, I don’t understand what you are saying. Are you from Wisconsin or something?
next gen e-scooters are to compete with the useless Southern Railway, with rail based ‘e-Scootas’ to use empty rail capacity. New company ScootRail says the carbon fibre Scootas will bypass all the traffic and bikes on the roads to give a trouble free and fun rail trip into the heart of the city. Details in Railway News here.
I honestly don’t think anything motorised (or actually anything) should be doing 15 mph on a pavement. And I get your point that if you and your family are on the pavement and the scooter is on the pavement that is more of a risk to you than if you are on the pavement and a car is minding its own business in the road.
On the road, scooters are more of a risk to themselves I think. I do have a pet hate of motorised transport in cycle lanes but I think now e-bikes are so prevalent it’s going to be even harder to give non powered (or person powered) bikes anywhere where they are away from motorised vehicles of various sorts. But overall the scooters are much less of a threat on the road. Although I was cycling up Perry Vale to the station today and two whizzed past me - I hadn’t realised how quiet they are and I didn’t know they were behind me so a good reminder (if I needed one, given I’d already cycled back from croydon purley way this morning) of the multiple hazards that can be around you on the road!
I so wish this had been true
Am probably really late to it but finally got round to checking this out: ‘The beat-poet Attenborough’: meet Ogmios, the mysterious star of the BBC’s best new comedy | Television | The Guardian
It is glorious! Has great relevance to this thread with his take on Scooterboys but, really, has much deeper resonance about the approach to travelling by road in the urban environment. Flow