We live very close to HOP station and our street has plenty of space to park in the evenings and at the weekends, once the station tourists have gone. During the day it’s a total pain and I’ve often had to park several roads away. Not ideal with a small child and a load of shopping. Perhaps parking restrictions in the middle of the day would help without affecting residents too much?
Off road parking for more than one car is very much the exception, where I live the ratio is one double or triple driveway for ever 25 single car driveways. Overall driveways are good for individuals but not for the street, they increase pollution, the risk of flooding and reduce the amount of parking on the street and look ugly. Although controlled parking is bad, it is worse if the street gardens are destroyed because it is seen as the only option for residents to be able to park on their street.
The problem could be solved with a CPZ. The problem is that Lewisham rather than give one permit per house free with subsequent charged there is no intersst in adopting it for many households.
A lot of councils offer a one car free permit (Barking, Newham are two I am aware of). Even if there was a one of fee I think it would be fair. Brighton has a yearly fee of £50 which would probably be acceptable?
Lewisham offer a £30 for fuel efficient vehicles, or £120 otherwise which is 33p/day, how much is parking in your street worth?
I could give up one coffee a week to pay for it which would be good for my health and my fellow residents and good for the drivers as some would inevitably opt to take public transport and walk a bit more.
The perennial issue is where you draw the line - otherwise a CPZ just shifts the problem. I know this sounds harsh, but station parking isn’t a new phenomenon and anyone who has bought a house near the station must have been able to appreciate that it’s going to be busy.
Dave, you’re right they brought it upon themselves and now should suffer in silence and stop complaining. If it becomes too much they should move further away from the station or destroy their garden if they can. I take it you don’t live near a station but near enough to fear that if they got one you might experience what they do. I could be wrong you could be one of those who likes driving round looking for a space near your house and then lugging your shopping and children in.
I think the response here is a bit disproportionate - I didn’t mean to upset anyone.
I’m not saying this at all - I just don’t see where you draw the line. Putting a CPZ in just shifts the problem around. There have been many discussions about this both here and on other local forums.
Arguably Honor Oak Park suffers more congestion these days because of the CPZ around Manor Mount, though, so maybe my initial feeling about it now being much the same as it’s ever been is wrong. Do we have any empirical data for this? Maybe someone on the forum has lived on Gabriel St / Grierson Road for a long time.
Personally I am unaffected by this phenomenon these days, by the way.
If you’re in a street where it is getting impossible to park, the only real answer is a Controlled Parking Zone (CPZ). Many Inner London boroughs already have CPZs for the whole of their area. Lewisham has them for most of the north of the borough. As the CPZs spread southwards, there is more and more pressure on those streets that don’t have them, especially if they are near key commuter stations.
Lewisham has in the (not very recent) past held ballots on whether residents wanted CPZs in the Honor Oak Park area. Their policy is formally set out in this document https://www.lewisham.gov.uk/myservices/parking/Documents/ParkingPolicyOctober2014.pdf
Section 2 describes the process for consulting on CPZs. There needs to be a 10 per cent minimum response to the consultation, and more than 50 per cent need to vote in favour.
If you think there might be support for a CPZ in your area, the first step should be to enlist the support of the local ward councillors to get it included in the schedule of forthcoming plans. It’s quite a big step, but it’s one many neighbourhoods have already been forced to take.
The CPZ round Manor Mount has been in for over 10 years. Honor Oak might have suffered 10 years ago from the CPZ going in there but I doubt you can say that it is increasing parking now.
I doubt very much that Manor Mount has any effect on Grierson road as they are about 5 minutes drive/20 minutes walk away from each other.
The David’s Road CPZ (Manor Mount etc) was put in to deter commuters but also Sainsbury’s staff and shoppers. It was very well received by the locals and I have never heard anybody campaign to get rid of it.
It probably shifted parking across the road to Taymount Rise but not enough for the residents to rise up and demand another CPZ going against the perennial argument that if you put in one CPZ, another is demanded at the border. We have had 10 years with no new CPZs in Forest Hill.
I think it is all about context. Commuters are likely to want to park within a short distance of the station. If a CPZ is put in place and they spend 20 minutes walking to and from their car, they think twice and many will pay for a car park or take public transport as the time saving has disappeared. I am not anti-commuter just pro resident and I think the residents have a right to say they are fed up with the situation and do something about it.
Thats great news though isn’t it ? Think about alternative means of transport…walk / cycle/ jog…please think about reducing car usage, you know it makes sense !
We are short of space in London and there is never going to be enough parking space to satisfy everyone. Therefore, there may have to be solutions to manage or curtail demand like CPZs. Or if that is not something car owners want to entertain that they will just have to accept that streets are public space and living somewhere does not give you a greater right to store your car there than anyone else.
I live on Taymount Rise and the shift to parking there is very annoying - it is a narrow, steep road and people often park very badly making life difficult for pedestrians walking up the hill, there are a good number of times when I am forced to walk out in to the road because of a badly parked car.
It’s getting to be a problem in Devonshire road as well. We live near the middle so not too bad but with churcheood gardens being built with 70 odd dwellings it could get worse if there isn’t enough parking on the estate. I think we did have a cpz consultation some time ago but it was rejected. Personally I would be in favour of a cpz but know that this is not a majority view.
I believe you have to have over 50% of householders to approve a CPZ?
Great info! Thank you!
There are mixed views as to whether CPZs actually work.
I’d be interested to know if there’s any concrete data that parking has reduced. I’ve noticed no difference around my corner of HOP.
When the CPZ was introduced in Waldenshaw Road and it’s environs it made a massive difference to parking volumes. What was a rammed carpal during the day and into the early evening became a sleepy residential road almost overnight. It was so bad at one point prior to the CPZ that the scooter born ticketed started turning a blind eye to a few of us from the surrounding roads parking in Sainsburys as there was no where else to park. I owe them for that.
I was born in Gabriel Street in 1966, so this photo was taken in Mid 1970’s
You can see there was parking then, but there were no fire gate so the traffic used it as a cut through
I’m not saying it wouldn’t work - just pointing out that there are very mixed views as to whether it would. I’ve met just as many people who say its a disaster from their experience as to those who swear by it. As with all of these things, hard data would be useful.
Personally, I think we should have less cars anyway, so not really any skin off my nose
Perhaps non drivers should be excluded from any vote!
Thank you to @bluefern for raising and other contributors to this thread.
I live on Gabriel Street and, though it has been an ongoing issue during my 6 years here, matters are definitely significantly worse in the past 6 months.
The recently-painted ridiculously long double yellow lines around corners and various builders/contractors parking during jobs/putting skips on the road, do not help. However, the problem is in my view primarily due to commuters from nearby areas using streets near to Honor Oak Park station as a car park during the working day. As I type on this Saturday Bank Day holiday, the street outside is reasonably clear with plenty of available parking; this is not the situation during the working week.
During the working week, I witness drivers parking up and walking to the station on a daily basis. Of course it is understandable why people may do so and I generally try to adopt to a ‘live and let live’ approach. However, when you cannot part on your own street or those neighbouring because commuters are using them as car park, there is a problem. There are also significant safety aspects where the scooters flying through these particular streets are less visible owing to bumper-to-bumper parked vehicles, in an area comprising many families and young children.
Gabriel Street residents have been concerned and discussed matters by email, one of whom approached Lewisham Council and received the reply at the base of this message.
I encourage anyone else in Gabriel or in neighbouring HOP streets to voice their concerns to the email addresses below. Once Lewisham transport department are engaged and looking at the issue, options and matters around cost, effectiveness etc. can be discussed and decided upon. I believe the time, though, has come to take matters forward.
Apologies for the overly long message.
Thank you for your email. I am sorry for the delay in replying.
The Council is always under pressure to look at different parking issues across the borough. To ensure we make best use of our available resources, we prepare a programme of CPZ consultations annually. This programme is prioritised based on criteria set out in our parking policy, which is available on the council website.
* To determine what’s in the programme we look at a number of factors and score these to work out priorities. The factors considered are:
* Evidence from borough-wide surveys
* Evidence from previous CPZ consultation identifying demand close to the 50% threshold
* Requests, complaints, representation or petitions from stakeholders relating to parking pressure
* Evidence of overspill from existing CPZs
* Parking studies undertaken by the Council or Developers
* Evidence of existing road safety issues
* Evidence to support strategic infrastructure, town centres or car free developments
* Introduction or changes to transport hubs.
We currently are in the process of assessing areas for review as part of our programme for 2017-18.
We have recorded your request for a CPZ in Gabriel Street and this will be considered, along with any other requests that may be received, when prioritising our CPZ review programme.
Casework – Transport
The relevant email addresses are: