Local politics section… an open forum?

Dear all,
I’ve recently been advised that the local politics section is reserved for established members of the forum only. This came about after I tried to post on a recent thread and couldn’t.
I was wondering what others’ thoughts were on this. I would much prefer it if this forum was open to all and not ‘members only’ - at the moment it feels a bit cloak and dagger, which has made reluctant to be involved in the past and continues to prevent me from contributing. But perhaps I’m in the minority? I would welcome feedback.
Thanks

Hasn’t Local Politics been open since December 2017 (see bottom of About the Local Politics category)?

I’m guessing this has come about because that topic got moved into Local Politics, and so the topic disappeared for those that had muted local politics and at least one member complained.

Perhaps that was a mis-recategorisation and there should be a new section “Forum Politics” for threads like the cyber-stalking one, though hopefully such a section would have woefully little in it!

It’s open for everyone to view… but not to post

Only Trust Level 2 and above can create and reply on Local Politics.
This is mainly to stop brand new members or alt accounts wading in.
Always good to get feedback on how people feel about this…

Initially It was an opt in category like General Politics. When the forum was created it was intended that Political discussion would be hidden from a public view of the forum. Local Politics was spun off as more people wanted to participate but it was kept at Trust Level 2.

I think I see smiris’ point. The original post was made in the #general topic, presumably to ensure it could reach the widest possible audience and gain maximum input from other members, new and existing. It did seem to attract some new commentators including smiris.

But this morning the group was changed which could be seen as an effort to limit discussion. Smiris no longer can participate in a thread they had already contributed to.

There’s probably good reason to limit this, and in hindsight this may have best been a lounge topic.

Chris decided to removed all my trust levels a few months ago because I posted something he didn’t agree with or like the look of (even though it was meant to be temporary). If one of the mods could look into this and let me know where I stand then please let me know as I would like to contribute to the thread.

Thanks for replying Foresthillnick.
I have to say the phrase “only trust level 2 and above can create and reply on Local Politics. The is mainly to stop BRAND NEW MEMBERS wading in” will really put off any brand new member from bringing their contributions to the forum as a whole.
Although I’m not a brand new member this is exactly the sort of thing that has put me off contributing in the past. Why can’t brand new members wade in as you put it? Are brand new members not to be trusted until they prove themselves with some sort of badge of honour?
It’s a very ‘members’ club’ mentality which I really don’t like (personal opinion) and I haven’t seen on other forums. Surely a local forum would be much better if it was open to all?

There is another local forum that is owned and moderated by one person. A lot, including me, came here as banning and post deletion were common place with no explanation given.

Whilst .Life is not perfect it tries hard to look at all options hence why there are a number of mods, not just one.

Finally, the trust level is only to stop “hit and run” joiners. If you are Verified you immediately move up on trust levels. So far it has worked well but suggestions are always looked at.

I had thought you’d flown the forum coop.

I think this is a good thing, and over here - Why can't brand new users send private messages? - we can also see the automatic ways to be promoted to trust level 2:

Specifically, this is how you get to trust level 2 (after which you can send PMs):

• visiting at least 15 days, not sequentially
• casting at least 5 likes
• receiving at least 5 likes
• replying to at least 3 different topics
• entering at least 20 topics
• reading at least 100 posts
• spend a total of 60 minutes reading posts

Or you can get verfied, which boosts you instantly to trust level 3.

I think a small barrier to entry for new members is a good thing, and automatic rules are a just and unbiased way to add trust.

A small barrier for entry for new members? Why? Honestly, it makes me want to just take my contributions such as they are elsewhere. Shame. Thanks for the feedback though.

Just to combat repetitive spam and disruptive or provocative comments made by hit-and-run accounts. This is just my opinion, though I’ve seen other forums (not local forums, other matters) suffer greatly from such problems by having totally open access.

Hummm. I’ve done all of these and I’m still level 1… are these still recent?

According to my Admin panel you are level 2.

@smiris - we really welcome your input on this and of course on the forum in general.
It is really as @ForestHull noted to prevent spam and provocative posts by drive by accounts.

Politics generates a lot of heat and it was thought best to at least get to know folk a little before getting into debates with them. It is an effort to take some of that heat out of the forum which can be off putting if it is on the public face of the site.

I take your point though and we have talked in the past about opening it up - we will look at it again.

More like wings clipped and chained to a post.

Hi Ross

I’ve had a chat with my fellow mods and we’ve put you back up to normal member status, which I think means you should be able to access everything you could before. Any issues let us know.

Thanks

Al

Cheers all

This seems to be conflating two issues. One is how to deal with local politics.

Another is a thread which relates to the functioning of this site and its relationship with the community. This isn’t local politics. It is about the forum.

How do you know what trust level you are?

Click on your pic - top right.
Click on your username
Click Expand

Is ‘regular’ = trust level 2 or trust level 3?
Is there a chart to help understand?

I am not sure if there is or not but…

Thanks again Foresthillnick for the feedback. But I have to say I’ve been rather put off this forum. As some others have suggested on other threads it feels a bit overmoderated.
It also seems particularly odd when I hear on another thread that other moderators have used sockpuppet accounts - it feels like it’s one rule for the powers that be on this forum (fake accounts, choosing who can be verified, deleting posts like mine), while the rest of us lowly occasional users have to ‘earn stars’ before we are deemed worthy enough to post on local politics threads. I’m now at ‘basic’ woohoo! Why not give people the benefit of the doubt first? You could always delete posts if people break forum rules.

On the one hand you say that you feel the site to be over-moderated but then say we should open everything up to everyone and then do more moderating if needed

It isn’t easy, we do our best and we take any criticism whether it is warranted or not.
At the moment we are not going to make any changes as, IMHO, the forum needs a period of rest and recuperation.

Fair enough. Rest and recuperation sounds like a good idea.
I guess what I mean is that it’s over-moderated in the way it’s run as a whole with deleted posts, having to earn a certain status, members only type of way. Does that make sense?
Anyway, will leave it there. As you say, nothing is going to change at the moment, so I guess that’s the end of the discussion!

Note that posts are rarely deleted - instead they are moved to the opt-in category of Moderator Actions, usually with a reason.

Looking at that category, there are perhaps one or two actions a week. For a site that claims 1.5k to 3k visits a day I really think that’s not bad going and a credit to all on this site.

I understand as a verified member I’m Trust 3, but am I 3 or 4?

You are Trust Level 3 - Regular…

“Trust Level” is such an unfortunate name for this process. To me, it feels more like some hierarchical system created by L. Ron Hubbard. I gather this is more a function of the software than of this site.

Michael, we are both verified regulars so trust level 3. You were of course trust level 4 for a while as were a few others, until the TL4 status was removed from all (non-team members) earlier this year. I gather that TL4 has been revived potentially as a half way house to moderation. Probably a good idea.

But yes. Not terribly clear how they work. Nicks little graph was helpful though.

Thanks Nick.

Trust level is also an unfortunate name on this forum given that I was genuinely looking forward to some patties from flavabaker and a new business opening in FH.

Stirring and being deliberately provocative is, of course, one way to impact trust too.

Incidentally the ‘Trust Level’ terminology isn’t defined by .life. It’s part of the standard Discourse set-up which is the open source forum software that the site runs on.

Not sure how that’s stirring or being provocative. It’s fact. If you’re asking for a level of trust from newbies or occasional users* like me then you need to be able to trust the moderators too. (*although I realise I’m becoming more of a regular user in trying to argue what I realise is a lost cause). Look, all I want is for an open local forum where everyone can join in on all discussions across this platform. I’m not going to say on the matter as I know it’s getting me nowhere and @foresthillnick has already said nothing will change for now.