Parking meters coming to Honor Oak Park?

No parking outside Sainsbury’s/Hattush etc on Thursday 2/9/21 whilst the meters are installed.

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Wonder what the reasoning for this is? I don’t often drive there, but when I’ve needed to park always found a space so the 20 minute time seemed to work well.

I guess a further attempt to discourage car use and / or raise revenue?

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Typical small brained council mentality to bring this in and it will be under the guise of reducing car use but ultimately is about revenue. The current system works well and allows people to go about their business. I would say it’s inevitable that we’re going to see CPZs imposed against the will of the residents in the next few years too.

The war against cars just becomes a war against business and it’s the small ones which will suffer as people will simply drive elsewhere for the convenience.

It’s all very well to try and change behaviour and encourage bike / public transport use but people forget that this is a country that has horrible wet / cold weather for many months of the year not to mention a totally inconsistent summer.

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Agree. Completely unnecessary measure that will make everyone’s life more difficult for little benefit (motorists will either (a) not park and not shop on the high street or (b) park on the adjacent streets - revenue generation for the council is likely to be modest at best IMHO).

As well as the vehicle owners and the businesses on the high street, residents of the adjacent streets will suffer greater traffic, parking and pollution issues as vehicles are rammed in there.

Extra frustrating when there is no problem that needs solving, much less to which this is a solution. Has not been consulted upon or justified AFAIK.
Extremely annoying.

Understand the prevailing pressures on councils but Lewisham gets a massive thumbs down on this action.

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I’m optimistically hoping it might end up with the same terms as the Brockley triangle (outside Marvelous Greens & Beans etc…) with the first 30 minutes still free:

I’ve never needed to park there myself, but have used similar parking to access local businesses in Sydenham High Street in the past. It was super handy.

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Good point. Hopefully so.

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Maximum 2 hours would hit some businesses (hospitality, hairdressers etc). I found it unclear from the notice in your photo whether you could pay in cash. I was pleasantly surprised recently to find that you could pay in cash at Girton Road. I had thought you needed a smart phone to park there. It was expensive though.

I am certain it won’t hit business.

Full report here: https://content.tfl.gov.uk/walking-cycling-economic-benefits-summary-pack.pdf

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It’s either by phone or the app by the looks of it.

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Thanks Leo (and for all the work you do for Lewisham).

I agree that promotion of walking and cycling is an important and worthwhile cause.

But that is little to do with this matter. I am not sure that quoting a polemic publication from TFL advocating the worth of cycling and walking provides any certainty whatsoever that installing parking meters along Honor Oak high street will not hit businesses. Nor does it address the other disbenefits raised in this thread.

The materials you cite are talking about benefits engendered by creating more cycle lanes, bigger side walks, more places to park bikes and the like (which I agree with) - none of which is the same as imposition of parking meters.

FWIW I doubt whether installing parking meters will promote walking or cycling (if that is the purported objective). Is there any evidence that installing parking meters like this leads to a change from car use to walking or cycling? In my view, people living close enough will continue to cycle or walk to the high street (i.e. little or no change). People who are further away are unlikely to change from car use to cycling or walking (in any significant numbers) in order to avoid the Honor Oak parking meters - they will simply drive elsewhere e.g. Sydenham retail park where parking is not charged. The business lost will be from that group and from people living in other areas driving through Honor Oak who simply will not stop on their way through (assuming that there is no free short term period).

Parking along the HOP high street presently limits stays to 30 minutes I believe; the issue or issues which parking meters are seeking to address and the benefits (against the number of disbenefits) are opaque to me, I’m afraid.

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Let’s just see. Those utilising free parking for longer than 30 minutes were probably doing so to commute from Honor Oak Park.

I’d be very surprised if any business in HOP, minutes from a train station and served by 5 bus routes, is getting a large of chunk of its business from people driving there.

If you’re travelling from under 5km away, you really shouldn’t be driving there anyway.

As the TFL report highlights, business owners often over predict the percentage of their customers travelling by car. But anyway, if these changes do clearly have destructive impact on the parade, they’ll likely be taken out again.

I agree that this should not be the end of things. Carrot and stick is needed to get that much needed ‘modal shift’ in London from cars to PT, walking, cycling. Unfortunately, the carrots - pavement widening, segregated cycle lanes, urban greening, LTNs etc, cost a lot of money and TFL’s finances are in a dire state after Covid-19.

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Some pavements could be widened for no cost, if cars were not parked on them!

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Did a councillor just cite a blog post from some fringe pressure group (“treehugger.com”) to justify new parking charges that evidently no one wants?

Mr Gibbons states: “If you’re travelling from under 5km away, you really shouldn’t be driving there anyway.”

Sorry Mr Gibbons, but please don’t tell me how I should and shouldn’t be travelling. You know nothing of my personal circumstances and fitness to walk or cycle. You know nothing of what I’m doing in town, and why I might need a vehicle to do it.

Why didn’t you ask businesses and residents if they wanted this? Who do you work for?

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Yes I did, I also cited a report by TFL.

“Evidently no one wants.” I don’t think you’ve got much evidence for that claim pal.

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If you read what people (the residents you’re meant to represent) are saying above, you’ll spot the evidence.

Unless you have counter-evidence from the public consultation you ran? Oh, wait…

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  • I want parking charges on Honor Oak Park
  • I don’t want parking charges on Honor Oak Park
  • I don’t care

0 voters

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And will only get worse if everyone stops using cars in congestion charging zones…

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This post was flagged and is temporarily hidden.

Problem resolved?

The temporary signs on Honor Oak high street - which said something like ‘parking suspended due to P and D installation’ - have disappeared.

No P and D installed but some parking signage appears to have been cleaned up/replaced.

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In 2019/20 public transport fares brought in £4.9Bn to TFL.

£1.3Bn came from commercial properties, road network compliance, advertising and Congestion Charge zone.

The net income of the Congestion Charge in 2017/18 was £155.9m, so pretty small fry compared to overall income. It’s primary goal is to discourage car traffic in central London, if it generates additional income as well, that’s just an additional bonus.

Until Covid-19, London has been the only major city in western Europe that hasn’t received direct Government funding to run day to day transport services - cos a deal by Boris Johnson as Mayor with George Osborne to make TFL self-funded. It doesn’t make sense to not invest in your capital city’s infrastructure like that IMO but hey ho TFL manned to survive until Covid-19.

If you genuinely want to help save TFL’s finances, get back on public transport and lobby the Government to offer a long-standing sustainable funding settlement to London.

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