The A205 Pedestrian Crossing Problem at Forest Hill Station

The following tweet from FHSoc is relevant:

@SophieDavis responded:

The problem is that Commonplace is a terrible way to try to engage. There’s no assurance of who or how many times an individual is adding comments or votes, or what sections of the community are reached. Worst still is that there seems to be no published analysis of reasons as to why some suggestions move forward, some are ignored, and the unlucky ones seem to silently disappear from the map altogether.

If this were all being done as an emergency response I would fully support rapid action, if bounded with a guarantee of later review and public consultation. But 3 months after lockdown started this has missed that opportunity already, and since little of this was on the Labour manifesto or listed in Lewisham Council’s corporate strategy, I think it is more important than ever that correct process is used so all suggestions are given fair, reasoned and transparent consideration clear of prejudice.

That crossing is a disgrace, as is that whole junction. However London Road is a red route and as I understand it Lewisham Council have little control or ability to do anything. It is TfL’s remit.

So why are we being encouraged to “keep adding comments to the Commonplace page” regarding this junction I wonder.

Going a bit off-topic, and my personal issue is really with the methods and not the results of this transport scheme…

The most obvious thing to do for the A205 junction would be to retime the lights to give pedestrians more time or more frequent crossing opportunities at little expense to road traffic while there are fewer vehicles.

Given TfL have a centralised Urban Traffic Control system, this may be possible without even visiting the site.

I’ve had a bit of a dig through the forum to see if there were actually any suggestions on how to improve the crossing in front of the station. There have been a few threads about some other junctions so maybe I missed an obvious one but… what if any solutions have been proposed?

If you have one longer ‘pedestrians cross all in one go’ phase then the traffic is going to build up in all directions. Underpasses? Bigger island?

Ha you posted this 30 seconds before I asked if there were any suggestions. I feel like the traffic is already worse than it was before lockdown, extending the phases is only going to make it worse I fear.

Do we have any live web enabled air pollution monitors in the area?

Perhaps to help Lewisham build a case to take to TfL? I am not sure how it works but I do know red routes are not under council control and they are mostly designed and laid out in favour of keeping traffic moving rather than being pedestrian friendly.

The A205 is a red route and runs through Clapham Common and there’s crossings every 10m and a 3-way zebra crossing which stops traffic every second for pedestrians. So this red route definitely favours pedestrians over vehicles.

So some sort of improvement for the poor residents of SE23 who have to put up with the south circular blighting their high street should definitely be considered by TFL. Clapham Common gives me hope… it’s also a shame that there aren’t more crossings along the south circular for people to cross over to Dulwich Park. A couple of zebra crossings would be great, traffic is slow along here anyway so wouldn’t interfere with traffic levels.

The A1 in Islington is also a Red Route (much wider than A205). But check out the difference - there are single phase crossings with plenty of time to cross, serious enforcement of bus/cycle lanes, and the Holloway Road section of the A1 has been made 20 MPH because it is heavily used by pedestrians as a shopping area. Whether that was TFL or Islington Council or both, it should be happening in Forest Hill and the rest of Lewisham.

What for? My previous comments have been erased and ignored.

They are supposed to be changing the traffic lights at The Grove to a pedestrian set at some point this year. There was a public consultation last year which means you’ll be able to cross at Cox’s Walk without taking your life in your hands. But that’s taken years to make happen; the previous recommended route was to walk from The Grove to the crossing at Overhill Road, then back along across Melford Road and Underhill Road to the crossing opposite the new flats and then back down to Cox’s Walk. So crossing 2 other roads to get to two crossings.

I’m pretty sure that last time there was a public response on the traffic island at the station we got a similarly convoluted answer - either to exit the station from platform 2, walk down Perry Lane, cross at the Co-op and then walk back up the hill - or to use the crossing outside the Dartmouth Arms as you should get across the road within a single traffic sequence. The argument that it doesn’t really help if you’re trying to get to the other side of the road didn’t seem to hold much weight.

The picture at the top is made worse by the girl on the bike at the front. If she’d got off her bike, and walked forward a little, there would be a lot more room on that island.

The Grove Tavern junction issues are more complex than what could be resolved at the London Road T Junction by the station.

The island needs to go with a straight forward crossing. I’d feel more safer not having to stand on a tiny island in the middle of the South Circular than if people had to stand on London Road or Waldram Cresent.

Agreed. This stretch of the South Circular is either totally free flowing or completely jammed. Taking 30 seconds out of the sequence to allow pedestrians to cross more safely would feel entirely sensible.

I went back to find a link to the announcement about the Grove Tavern consultation and exactly how long these things take. I found the promise of a consultation in 2013, a question to the Mayor of London in 2014 with a promise they’d look at it. A consultation in September 2018, an acceptance in May 2019 that they’d do something in early 2020 and, to date, no action. Interestingly, the proposal there was for a staggered crossing but so many people wrote back requesting a single one, they have gone back to see if it’s possible.

So I wonder how we’d go about actually getting it back on the radar again?

Thank you for the info on Grove Tavern. It seems rather odd that on such a long strip of road (from Grove Tavern to the Dulwich college crossroads) that there is only one pedestrian crossing!

Aside from the cyclists on the FH island this crossing is absolutely ridiculous at rush hour and weekends. You have to wait a stupidly long time to get to the middle island and then wait again for the next set of lights to change so you can cross. On top of this the island isn’t big enough. A single crossing with all traffic halted at one point would be much beneficial. Pedestrians must come first in a high street. Expecting pedestrians to walk 30m+ in an opposite direction to cross at the co-op is ridiculous at a time when we are trying to put pedestrians first over cars. Surely it is long overdue for the council to step up and sort out the FH crossing!

…whilst you watch your train pull into the station and then depart.

I think I timed it: it’s 3 maybe 4 minutes if you get to the crossing just as the left filter light goes green and you have to wait a full cycle.

I hadn’t noticed that, as I can only see the photos if I click through to Twitter.

Maybe as a quick measure we could request “cyclists must dismount” signs? She’s breaking Rule 79 of the Highway Code.

Rule 79

Do not ride across equestrian crossings, as they are for horse riders only. Do not ride across a pelican, puffin or zebra crossing. Dismount and wheel your cycle across.

She’s not only putting the people around and behind her in danger, she’s going to be a hazard for those people she’s going to be cycling through as they try to cross the road from the opposite side.

It’s virtually impossible to cross there using a walker or pushing a wheelchair. Do the barriers actually achieve anything? The barriers at Mayow Road/Sydenham Road went years ago and it’s much easier to cross there now.

Like many pedestrian crossings, the timings are too short to allow time for the less able to cross.

Personally I’m not a fan of the trend to remove barriers around crossings for busy roads. It feels a lot less safe when you are trying to wrangle small children and/or a pram and are made by the traffic light timings to wait in the middle of the road.

The changes made to the Stanstead/Cranston junction are another example of this, and quite poorly thought out for pedestrians, in my opinion.

We used to have that issue with trying to catch the 356 bus when arriving by train of an evening. The frustration of trying to get to the bus stop at the Capitol before your half hourly bus arrived and left without you. Especially as there was already a bus stop outside Leaders for the 185. Eventually - I’d like to think TFL took notice of all the complaints - we got the bus added to the list of those that stop there too.

I agree she shouldn’t be on her bike, but I have to admit I’ve never seen anyone cycle across here before - it makes little sense. Is she going to try to cycle up the pavement.

I don’t think a sign is worth it for something that shouldn’t be happening in the 1st place. Otherwise I’d petition to get a sign that says ‘Cars should not stop in the ASL box’ which is also obvious and probably happens a lot more frequently.

I’ve been stuck in a box when drivers in front of me faffed about and I got caught out by the lights changing. I and others who get caught like this aren’t breaking the law, according to Ask the Police, but it is really embarrassing because of course people arriving at the junction afterwards think you’ve done it deliberately.

I think it’s worth considering signage for both though as you’ve already got the street furniture (ie the light stands) to pin it to.

You’d think in the case of the photo it would have been easier for the woman to push her bike across like the chap behind her is doing, rather than riding across, so it seems a strange decision.

If the traffic lights are on red, drivers (including motorcyclists and scooter riders) must not cross the first stop line - if they do they could liable to a £100 fixed penalty and three penalty points on their driving license.

If the lights change from green to amber as a driver (including motorcyclists and scooter riders) approaches but they cannot safely stop before the first stop line, they can cross the first line but must stop before the second stop line. In these circumstances it is not an offence to stop in the marked area.

Drivers (including motorcyclists and scooter riders) should avoid blocking/encroaching onto the marked area at other times e.g. when the junction is blocked.

Note that just because there’s a car in the ASL box does not mean to say the driver has committed an offence. The offence is only committed when the vehicle enters the ASL box when the light is red. If the vehicle enters the box and the light changes to red, no offence is committed.

Cyclists must not cross the second stop line while the traffic signal is red. Contravening a traffic signal is against the law, and could result in a £50 fine.

Yes you’re correct about the law and getting stuck in the ASL box. Unfortunately some people like to stop in them on purpose as a mini protest against their existence because they get frustrated about bikes being out in front. They’re almost impossible to enforce because of the ‘cannot safely stop’ thing.

My point about signage is more that you shouldn’t have to remind people about basic traffic laws with signs everywhere. Cyclists should know not to ride on pavement and motorists should know not to stop in the ASL boxes.

Sorry for the flag etc! …

I’d have to agree , I have witnessed two scary but relatively minor accidents in the last year at this crossing , one on the way to school and the other on the school run home , so I am grateful that the barriers are there.

ASLs should be a static offence just like yellow boxes. Don’t go in unless you can get out. No brainer really.

Station junction is absolute rubbish, desperately needs a straight across phase for pedestrians on the northern arm.

Acrually that’s not quite the case. This is the rule for box junctions:

Rule 174

Box junctions. These have criss-cross yellow lines painted on the road (see ‘Road markings’). You MUST NOT enter the box until your exit road or lane is clear. However, you may enter the box and wait when you want to turn right, and are only stopped from doing so by oncoming traffic, or by other vehicles waiting to turn right. At signalled roundabouts you MUST NOT enter the box unless you can cross over it completely without stopping.

That’s why some very careful motorists can get stuck in box junctions if oncoming traffic isn’t so careful and stops and blocks the junction.

I agree we need a straight across phase. @ForestHull @FashionClearance i completely get your point about safety. Maybe with a straight across timing the barriers could be less of a slalom and more sensibly designed to protect yet not hinder pedestrians. The current design sees us too often squeezed out.

and is happening everywhere else in London

I think they should take some of the station car park and move the road a bit in order to widen the pedestrian refuge in the middle of the road.

I think it is unlikely that we will get a pedestrian only phase because it would negate the usefulness of the left filter arrow. Priority is always given to traffic and not to pedestrians. I usually go up to Forest Hill on the bus to avoid difficult road crossings.

Not everywhere. It doesn’t have to be this way.

It seems to me that the adversarial nature of our politics is so divisive that everything gets polarised. Local Councillors/council officers and London Mayor/TFL think of walkers and cyclists as on one side and motorists as the other side. So it’s all out for one side or the other. It gets photo opps, career boosts and bonuses but whatever they do is extreme, because the small tweaks that could often make junctions easier and safer don’t grab headlines and do nothing for political ambition.

Hi all, I spoke with Ellie Reeves’ team about this and she agreed to write to TFL to put some pressure on them. She’s made the letter public on twitter here:

I know @SophieDavis has been liaising with staff at TFL about this matter and they have said a lack of funding has prevented the necessary upgrade works on the pedestrian island. They are currently investigating whether the phasing of crossing lights could be amended to give pedestrians more time to cross.

Really great to see/hear this @LeoGibbons, thank you, @SophieDavis and Ellie too.

Hopefully re-timing the lights can be done easily enough with current traffic volumes while budget and plans are made for a more permanent (and overdue) improvement.

Could we not use some of those funds for blocking Bishopsthorpe to block the Road? Much safer and quieter - plus many more residents would appreciate it!

If you are suggesting that Lewisham may wish to share some of it’s Covid-19 emergency funds with TfL in order to more urgently and better address the issue of the A205 crossing, I think you may have a point.

The current pavement refurbishment of Devonshire Road is a bit of a puzzle in this context. The work will continue over several months (expensive). The pavement is not being widened to improve pedestrian safety. Although the pavement is in poor condition, just refurbishing without considering changes seems … strange.

Pavements are being replaced across the borough, aren’t they? I assume there was a separate pot of funding for that project. Not sure, but if anyone has a link to any detailed info it might be an interesting thing to share.

Why not just get rid of all those ugly grey barriers that box you in and make you feel claustrophobic, and have the same open crossing that Oxford Circus has?

because lorries come wide around that 90 degree corner. With no barrier they are gpoing to splatt a few locals

I think @Poppet21 is suggesting not having an island at all and having an entire stoppage of traffic in every light sequence that would allow people to cross the road in one go (diagonally from station towards the Capitol as well as straight across). So no need to worry about lorries making the turn.

I’m slightly dubious as to whether the railing that is currently there would do much against 15 tonnes of artic… not having one that people could lead backwards from might be safer!

@applespider You are probably right - not a bad idea if we can keep the Oxford Street God bothers with loudspeakers away

The lorries go round the three 90 degree corners with no care for anyone, hand on horn; they only stop if something is going to damage them. I’ve seen them happily drive over the bollards on devonshire road because they are plastic - a body wouldn’t do them much damage

Looks like someone didn’t quite manage the turn and destroyed the railing and a planter.

IMG_24464032×3024 5.2 MB

Can’t believe how many cars I’ve seen recently that have used the wrong side of the road to go round into London Road. Yesterday a cyclist nearly got hit as another car just drove on the right hand side of the road.

Hi all,

This is the response Ellie Reeves MP received from TFL last month regarding our request for this crossing to be improved.

Dear Ellie,

Thank you for your email regarding the crossing on London Road, near Forest Hill station.

This crossing was due to be improved during our 2015/2016 Crossing Works Programme. However, due to the 2015 Comprehensive Spending Review, this did not go ahead and it was put on hold. The scheme was being considered as part of our Healthy Streets Local Schemes (HSLS) and the team had started to carry out pedestrian surveys.

Unfortunately, the Healthy Streets Programme, which this scheme is a part of, has been significantly impacted due to the coronavirus pandemic. In March 2020, in line with Government guidance, we brought all project sites to a temporary safe stop unless they needed to continue for operational safety reasons. As such, the team were unable to continue with pedestrian surveys and this scheme has been paused as we continue to deal with the coronavirus pandemic.

Our income has significantly reduced and we are currently operating on an emergency budget from the Government. The emergency budget will last until October and will enable us to keep running our services during this time. We have recently published a revised budget which will form the basis for our next round of negotiations with Government, for funding from October onwards. The outcome of these negotiations will determine what programmes we will be able to fund for the subsequent months.

I can confirm that this scheme is being considered to restart, should we receive sufficient funding from the Government in the next funding agreement. I know this will not be the response that you were hoping for, but I hope it provides some explanation for why this scheme cannot proceed any further at this stage.

I’m going to have a chat with Ellie’s team about a few things this week (including issues with Thames Water/Leaks/London Road) and I’ll suggest that we write back to TFL to ensure we get a response following the signing off of their revised budget from October. Fingers crossed there’ll be enough money in the coffers to finally carry out this Crossing Works programme.

Kind regards,

Cllr Leo Gibbons

P.S. London has been the only major city in western Europe that hasn’t received direct Government funding to run day to day transport services since it was cut by the last Government.. This is thanks to a 2015 agreement between then-chancellor George Osborne and then-mayor Boris Johnson that London’s transport network should be self-funding…

That’s useful, thank you for the update.

Interestingly they mention they don’t have the budget for this much needed work but they had the budget to re-pave the whole of Devonshire Road that none of us residents asked for (or particularly required - making good to the damaged paving was all that was needed).

And also they found more than a million pounds to spend on the blanket #20mph project, which had barely any measurable effect on speed or safety.

I’m cynical when I hear central govt being blamed for the council’s lack of budget for transport improvements.

I think it’s right to be cautious about such claims. There is probably some substance in it but it may not be the whole story.

Clare, it should be noted that the right turn into London Road on the westbound South Circular can be made from either lane. The lane markings indicating this are near invisible as it happens which doesn’t help.

Correct, but I have seen cars make the turn on the wrong side of the pedestrian island! I thought maybe Claire was referring to that very dangerous but thankfully infrequent manoeuvre.

I was going to say the same thing, though to be honest ‘going around the outside’ as a car is also a little perilous - on entry to London Road you are immediately greeted with a lane merge at a pedestrian crossing, potentially with a bus pulling out or pulling in, or both!

As a focal point to Forest Hill, so much of that junction needs re-thinking. And I don’t particularly care if it’s owned by TfL, who the Mayor is or was, and where funding is or isn’t provided. It would just be nice if those that have been elected could work together to improve things without laying blame or trying to score political points.

I meant they were using totally the wrong side of the road. Driving into on coming traffic.
I think in just the last 6 weeks I have seen 4/5 drivers doing the same mistake on that part of the road. Fortunately no one was injured with any of them, but it was extremely close with the cyclist the other day.
I have no idea why they should think a busy two way road would suddenly disappear at traffic lights.

I’m very interested in this seemingly insane manoeuvre, but also very confused as to what is happening. Can you please explain the details?

• Which road do they approach from? I think this has to be Dartmouth Road or the A205.
• Do they go on the right hand side of the traffic island on the road before they enter the junction?
• Do they go on the right hand side of the traffic island on the road as they leave the junction onto London Road?
• Is it something else?

Car approaches the junction FH station on its left, pedder estate agent on right.
Car then drives on the wrong side of the road to turn right to go up London Rd. (Would be in the grey car’s lane) head on,
& wrong side of pedestrian crossing.

Picture taken from google maps just for road layout. Hope that makes it clearer Beige.

image732×1077 223 KB

When I used to sit in From The Forest, Hassan and I used to see it regularly. A good few close calls there. Also suicidal pedestrians who had only getting their train in mind and would bolt across the road. It’s not a great junction.

If you miss the pedestrian light by Pedder and wait for a green, then you get to the middle and it’s red to cross part 2 to Smiths. It takes a full 3 minutes to get from one side to the other if you just follow the lights and often I’ve been ‘on time’ for a train and still missed it. Nothing more frustrating than watching your train pull away while you can’t get across. So yes sometimes that’s why people go ‘suicidal’. Or you build in a 3 minute contingency into your station route plan.

You mean they actually do that ? That is breathtaking. I suppose i am surprised yet not surprised. For me that is just another example of what happens when you have virtually zero visible law enforcement on the streets and a growing culture of transgression where an increasing amount of people just get used to the idea that they can do what they want when they want, with minimal chances of being challenged and a still less chance of actually being caught.

thank you - very clear.

I chose life over the 8:32

I know it could be marked better and it is an awful junction. BUT If you’re approaching up that hill it’s kinda obvious isn’t it that traffic is approaching from the right and it’s not three lanes… unless they are just reckless and trying to beat the traffic?

It’s so crazy, I wonder if there’s some kind of GPS mapping glitch where someone has databased 3 lanes in that spot and it says ‘get in the third lane to turn right’ and people stare at screens rather than the road. I have no idea how you could make that mistake in real life.

There’s no glitch in the satnav’s - I’m pretty sure the problem is with the nut behind the steering wheel

Agreed. I have seen a few do it on purpose when their lane is booked but the majority have the kind of look on their face that I do when I realised I just turned down a one way street, the wrong way.

Too much signage?

9 posts were split to a new topic: FHSoC: Prioritising Pedestrians at Forest Hill Rail Station

I think there should be double white lines down the middle of the road.
Also it also helps if arrows indicating traffic direction are painted in lanes.

but they found the money for New Year fireworks that no-one could attend

I’ve never, ever had a problem or faced any challenges when driving on that stretch of road either coming down London road towards Dartmouth or Stanstead roads or approaching it from either side as well. Fine, I appreciate that you could be distracted by young passengers but as a seasoned motorist I’ve put most minor collisions, etc. I’ve witnessed in London down to poor awareness and possibly not having a driver’s license in the first place.

Yes indeed our town centre is designed for drivers, actually we should rename the station ‘A205’

Good to see Forest Hill Councillor @LeoGibbons still making a little bit of noise about this crossing over on Twitter too:

For some more context, Leo previously posted TfL’s response to local MP Ellie Reeves up the thread where TfL stated:

I can confirm that this scheme is being considered to restart, should we receive sufficient funding from the Government in the next funding agreement. I know this will not be the response that you were hoping for, but I hope it provides some explanation for why this scheme cannot proceed any further at this stage.

It’s a tough call whether fun annual traditions and entertainment should be paused in order to free funds for lasting improvement projects, and I’m not sure what this year’s display actually cost.

It would have been a bit miserable if there hadn’t been any New Year’s celebration though.

I can’t tell if Leo is sincerely asking the question about the crossing, or mocking “pale and stale” people who criticise Sadiq Khan?

the latter

Yes I thought so. Publicly making a racial slur against his own constituents, mocking their call for transport improvements.

Imagine the righteous outrage if he’d criticised another ethnic group? I don’t see how this is any more defensible.

Not a great tweet from Leo.

Just a quick question. I used the crossing most week days for 16 years. Apart from suicidal pedestrians what exactly is the problem with it?

There is not enough room in the centre for the number of people crossing the road. This leads to pedestrians being unable to get into the tight pen between fast moving traffic - this in turn leads to pedestrians spreading outside the cage in the centre of the road.

The other problem is the timing. The cars stop coming from London Road and there are a couple of seconds before the cars come out of Dartmouth Road. One person can happily skip across the road, but if others step out they put themselves in danger and can’t get back on the over-crowded island.

This crossing is particularly problematic when large numbers of people are rushing for a train.

Why did TfL need to upgrade the junction with Brockley Rise, Honor Oak Road, Sydenham Hill, Waldram Park, Sydenham Rise, and crossing outside Sainsburys all before this major junction?

It’s especially difficult, if not downright dangerous for the frail or disabled or those pushing prams or wrangling small children.

I can’t speak for the others, but I think the Brockley Rise / South Circular one was long campaigned for by parents at Dalmain and elsewhere as it was a crossing used by young children daily to get to school and was viewed by many as quite dangerous and difficult to navigate with multiple children / during school rush and / or for kids walking to school by themselves due to it’s close proximity to Dalmain.

It was possibly easier to resolve also, I’m not sure.

It is horrible and dangerous, especially in pre Covid rush hours. It is a classic of road design that prioritises traffic over the well being of pedestrians and the livability of the local area.

That said, the amount of confusion and poor lane discipline I see from drivers at that junction leads me to think it isn’t that well designed for anyone.

It’s easy to be complacent, in a safe seat with no viable opposition. Lord Mandelson once said: “The people of south Wales will always vote Labour because they have nowhere else to go”. That also used to be said of Scotland and a lot of places in England.

It is all about your perspective.

There are many who don’t see Leo as being fair and equal towards all sections of society who probably think he deserves a place on that Wall and probably many others who feel he is right to highlight the pale and stale people but we all need to try to get along and make Forest Hill a better place.

Sorting this difficult junction would help for all the reasons given plus I think it stops trade for some shops. I walk to Sainsburys regularly, coming from Dartmouth Road and always avoid that crossing, crossing further up and consequently rarely use Superdrug or the other shops/cafes on that section of London Road.

Agreed. The design of the road does that, the pollution and inability to socially distance. Many streets of London have at least widened the pavements either permanently, or with temporary barriers for the pandemic. I often have the sense that none of the people who are supposed to be representing our interests are fighting our corner.

That is what I thought was being described but was at a loss to understand how anyone would ever think that was what you needed to do!! Shows how naive I am!

I’m always hearing about “lack of funding”, and yet

“Damien Egan, Lewisham’s mayor, revealed the programme at the iconic Rivoli Ballroom, after the borough won its bid for more than £1m of funding to stage a series of events at venues across the borough next year.”

I know which I think is most important - between an improved pedestrian crossing or a temporary indoor beach.

Soo… A London Borough wins £1m funding from the GLA, specifically for the delivery of a programme of cultural activities for the benefit of its community… you can’t then take that grant and spend it on completely unrelated matters that were not in the scope of our bid.

Devonish, if you’d like I can arrange for you to have a chat with our Cabinet Member for Finance and our Chair of the Audit Panel and they can outline just how little money there is left beyond that available for the provision of our statutory services. Occasionally, we receive pots of grant-funding for specific projects (such as the Borough of Culture) but these can only be used for specific purposes.

6 posts were split to a new topic: Local funding priorities

I would agree with the need of double white line - from the pedestrian crossing in question (PEDDER/WHSmith) all way through the bend in A205 covering Devonshire Road- Waldram Crescent (obviously allowing entry to Devonshire Road).
Many times those motorcyclists (coming towards forest hill) trying to take-over cars from same direction, cross and drive on to the opposite lane (oncoming traffic) which can have catastrophic outcome. Have experienced it on several occasions (near misses thankfully).
Going back to the crossing, it will also need a longer “tail” from the pedestrian island, to mark separation of lanes from oncoming traffic; hopefully preventing wrong/illegal right turns.
Also railings should be painted with reflexive colours.